Peter Jones’ reality check for overconfident tech entrepreneur! | Dragons’ Den – BBC

Peter Jones’ reality check for overconfident tech entrepreneur! | Dragons’ Den – BBC


Next up is Holmfirth-based tech
entrepreneur Martyn Gould, who has a lot riding on his trip
to the Den. Today is huge for us and our company
because we’ve worked really hard for the last two years,
to build something that’s great but we’ve recognised that we need
some help. Martyn’s decided that to win the
Dragons over, honesty is the best policy. I’m going to be transparent,
I’m going to be friendly, and, hopefully, when I get back in that lift, I’ll have a big smile on my face! Hi, Dragons. My name’s Martyn Gould,
I’m the CEO of Yboo. I’m here today to ask for an
investment of £250,000 for a 2.5% equity share in our
business, Yboo Limited. Dragons, did you know that in the UK
every single year, consumers overpay for mobile phone
contracts? They don’t know what they use,
so they don’t know what to buy and the market is deliberately
complicated. We made Yboo to solve that
problem. One, download Yboo. Two, use your smartphone as
normal. Three, sit back and wait for Yboo to
match you to a deal that’s best for you. Not only do we match you on price,
but we also match you on signal strength and we’re ideally
placed to scale in the UK and internationally,
but we need you guys onboard to help us do that quicker. Look forward to receiving any
comments about the product. An app that tracks your call and
data usage to recommend the best mobile phone deals is the offering
from Yorkshireman Martyn Gould. He’s asking for a sizeable £250,000
for a 2.5% share in his business. Sara Davies is keen to know more
about Martyn’s experience in the mobile phone zone. Martyn. Hello. You are from the industry?
Absolutely. We’ve been in the telecommunications
industry for 20 years. I was one of the first employees at
Cellnet when it was analogue, and the networks know us. And do they love our team and our
people? Absolutely. You’ve just gone in, found a few of
the best people, put the super-duper, awesome team
together? We’ve built a team to solve a real
problem for consumers and mobile networks, and we’ve got
the foundation to grow. And I do believe in it because I’ve
spent 14 months with no salary, no income, spending my savings to
launch this service. That’s how much I believe in it. Martyn’s passion and his impressive
credentials seem to be going down well with Sara Davies. Peter Jones made his first millions
in mobiles. How will Martyn fare being quizzed
by an expert? Martyn, hi.
Hi, Peter. You said the selling point is the
fact that it will tell you the coverage where you live…
Yeah. ..and the best network for
you. Yeah. How do you get that information? So, we crowdsource it from users
and we know that people have their mobile phone with them
all the time. This is from our own systems and our
own algorithms. And how many users do you have? So, to date, we’ve had 40,000 people
that have downloaded our app. And how many people in the UK have a
mobile phone? So, there’s 60 million people that
have a consumer connection. 60 million people have a connection? Yes. And yet 40,000 people tell you where
the coverage is? So, I’m going to go on your site. I bet, and I put my postcode in,
you’re not going to know whether the coverage is good for me
or not. So, if we don’t know, we’ll tell you
that we don’t know. We’re completely transparent and
we’ll tell you… So, I get a message back to say,
“I’m sorry, I just don’t know it”? As we scale in the UK, we’ll have
more detailed crowdsourcing information and, hopefully… Well, you won’t get it –
that is my point. You’d be far better to utilise… ..an average network coverage map. I… I think we’ve made the right
decision in not using operator maps and being independent of every
single mobile network. The operator maps are static, they
take no account of population. I totally agree with you,
but you’ve got 40,000 people out of a population of 60 million. Martyn’s failure to embrace
all the data available to improve his service signals
trouble with Peter Jones. Will he get a better reception from
Deborah Meaden on the subject of the company’s
finances? How much money have you spent
so far? So, we’ve spent about… ..£1.1 million. And that’s across the whole of our
business. So, that’s on technology
development, patents, operations, sales, people, premises. OK, and marketing? £300,000. You see, I think £300,000… ..I’d have expected, possibly,
to have heard of you. OK. And £300,000 for 40,000 sign-ups. Does that sound like a good return
to you? No. The reason we’re here today is
because we need your experience to grow quicker. So, tell me what happens on day two. Here’s £250,000,
what are you going to do with it? So, we’re going to use that money
to launch internationally. What is the rush to go
internationally, when you haven’t even tested the
market fully here? I think there’s a huge desire to go
internationally because the product’s portable. One of our key target areas
is Australia. Because of the geographic landmass,
there’s a real problem with signal strength out there. So, Martyn… ..you know, sometimes people can’t
get right what’s in front of them. Yeah. They’ve got expectations to go
somewhere else. We think that our app has the
potential to scale internationally, and, you know, that’s the return
for investors. I mean, it’s like saying, you know,
you can’t get UK right, maybe there’s a softer target
elsewhere. I think you’re delusional. OK. Martyn’s plans for world domination
haven’t gone down well with a wound-up Touker Suleyman. And it looks like he’s not off the
hook yet, as Peter Jones wants more
information on the company coffers. What has been your last year’s
turnover? I’m assuming this is going to be a
very, very big number because you valued your business
today at ten million. It’s not as big as we want it to be
but we’re well-placed to scale. In the millions,
what’s your turnover been? So, for the financial year ’18-19,
we’re going to post revenue of around £50-60,000. £50-60,000? Absolutely. ..sitting on my chair.
OK… OK, well, that’s… I wasn’t sort of
expecting that. Wow, how do you go from there? Do you want to know why we’ve
arrived at the valuation, would that help? No, I don’t think you could put
any level of common sense to that valuation. Martyn? Peter might not want to know,
but I do… ..because I’m fascinated! I think the other thing, Deborah,
that supports our valuation – less than 12 months ago, one of the
major price comparison sites tried to buy us. The valuation that they gave us at
that time was £5 million. Is it possible to see that offer? Yeah, I’ve got it here. Oh, right.
Would you like to see it? All right. Yeah, please, love to see
that. Thank you. You said that you received an offer
for £5 million for the company. Yep. Here’s the reality. You raised… ..£2.1 million… ..1.5 million of debt,
650 of equity, only to receive an offer from this
company… Yep. ..of two million, and they would
have invested two million on the basis of the fact that the
company’s already got £650,000 of cash. So, the offer that you really
had was not five million. To be clear, sorry, I probably
misrepresented what happened, by accident.
Well, I’m not sure… The debt facility was after that
offer arrived. We did not have that £1.5 million
debt facility on the table when that offer arrived. But you can’t use that as a
suggestion that your company, a year ago, was worth five million. Your company was worth significantly
less than that, and the offer shows that in writing. OK. So sadly, I’m not going to invest
today, and say that I’m out. Tech tycoon Peter Jones dismisses
Martyn’s valuation of his company and is the first to exit
proceedings. And the flaws in Martyn’s finances
haven’t gone down well with Deborah Meaden either. I’m not happy about somebody
standing in the Den, who is misrepresenting an offer to
the level at which this offer has been misrepresented. So, to get that letter, I presented
to their board, their complete UK operating board. There’s things and conversations
behind that letter which makes me believe it’s
completely genuine. That makes it worse. This is clearly just an indicative
proposal. You’re either very naive or you
think I’m very naive. Well, it must be me. It’s me. Well, either of those scenarios
are not one that I particularly want
to be part of. So, I won’t be investing. I’m out. Martyn, I think you’re in a very
difficult position but you’re an optimist. What would be even better is if
you’re a realist. OK. And I think it’s a good piece
of technology, actually. But really, the value of this
technology only comes in when you’ve got about five million
users and you can get the accurate data that you need. For me, it’s not an investment
today. Good luck. I’m out. So, Martyn, you’re not a big
company. You’re doing £50,000 a year
turnover. A little market stall that does
more than that. So, you’ve got a valuation,
£10 million, which is probably worth no more
than a million. As it stands today, you think
a Dragon will come along and save you. One thing’s for sure – I’m not! I’m out. That thorny issue of Martyn’s
valuation just won’t go away, as Touker Suleyman becomes the
fourth Dragon to hang up on the investment proposition. But does Sara Davies think she’s
spotted a kindred spirit in the entrepreneur? Do you know what’s funny, Martyn,
is I’m a salesperson. That’s what I do all day, every day,
day in, day out. I sell. And I’m watching you and I’m trying
to read your body language as you’re going because it takes
one to know one. OK. I think you’re a great sales guy.
Thank you. But I actually think you are
believing a lot of what’s in that letter. And that for me is what’s
worrying me. And that’s why I’m out. Thank you. Good luck. Cheers, Martyn.
Thank you, thank you. So, that’s it for Martyn. The confident entrepreneur remained
cool under pressure, but in the end,
his company price tag proved a hot spot he just couldn’t
get away from. Thank goodness you asked for that! So, that letter,
in black and white, says… ..we’ll buy your company for a lot
of money, and after two years after we’ve put
more of our money into your company, we’ll give you more money. He’s a good salesman. I think the Dragons have missed a
trick. I hope I bump into them all in a
couple of years, and I can buy them a drink.

Randy Schultz

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100 thoughts on “Peter Jones’ reality check for overconfident tech entrepreneur! | Dragons’ Den – BBC

  1. john doe says:

    All grill aside, he seems like a coolheaded bloke

  2. kyle pender says:

    Does Peter know how many voters are used in UK exit polls? With good sampling techniques you dont need that high a sample size to get relatively reliable data.

  3. Twin Turbo says:

    An app that tracks your data, text, and phone use, well here in Canada Bell already does that for free.

  4. lotrgirl27 says:

    1:16 prime resting b** face

  5. Carrie Piazza says:

    40,000 people is more than enough to statistically cover an area that has millions of people as long as the 40,000 are distributed somewhat evenly and are running the app relaying information. The real question is the distribution of those 40,000. How the hell do these "Dragons" make money not understanding things like that??

  6. Kristy Kelly says:

    Let me break Australia down for you without an app. City slickers – Vodaphone has the best prepaid data, or just go with who has the cheapest and best data. Rural you're stuck with Telstra. That's all you need to know. You get stooged horribly but if you're in the boondocks you need Telstra. Optus if you're lucky.

  7. Jose Pineda says:

    Barbara: I’m not even English and for that reason I am out.

  8. Pinkaugust says:

    This presentation reminds me that Epstein didn't kill himself.

  9. Farvadude says:

    1:00 i actually think this is a good concept assuming it actually works mathematically, but he's out of his league with these people. he shouldn't have expected success given the numbers he's given them.

  10. Fedor Galkin says:

    Ive seen like 50 of these vids already and only in 1 of them dragons took the offer.
    That's some bad conversion

  11. v5red says:

    40,000 is plenty of users to estimate service levels for 60,000,000. Has Peter ever seen a proper scientific study? The much better question is how well those 40,000 are distributed. If 10,000 are evenly distributed it would be more useful than 1,000,000 poorly distributed

  12. Mr Off Topic says:

    Jenny: I'm not going to work today and for that reason, I'm out.

  13. Wonderful Life says:

    9.05 Oh no I can't believe it. Debbie said "I am not happy".

    Well which one are you then?

  14. Robert Sun says:

    https://www.businesscloud.co.uk/news/investor-row-blamed-for-collapse-of-dragons-den-firm

    lol the company died

  15. Paul Russo says:

    Jenny.

  16. karthik kadadevarmath says:

    Bro i live Australia you'll get service here everywhere

  17. Conor Farrell says:

    Tej looks like the puffer fish

  18. Kendall Harris says:

    I want to be heavily invested in the video and what The Dragons have to say but, Deborah Meadon's neck and cheeks drag me down to the bottom of the screen.

  19. Doctor Drake says:

    40,000 is a good sample size, you don't need all 60 million. the 40k is basically irrelevant in this case, what he should be looking for is how much percentage of the land area do they have data on.

  20. zahrans says:

    I am out and for that reason I am Jenny

  21. Louis Tracy says:

    When did everybody start beginning every statement with the word 'so'?

  22. Mark Hickman says:

    All android phones tell you all your usage in the settings 👏😂

  23. Dunn123 says:

    "I believe in transparency. I want to be transparent and pitch as transparent as possible."
    >Oversells the business by 4 million.

  24. dilwich says:

    He hasn't been the same since he left REO Speedwagon . . . .

  25. Youtubaholic says:

    The letter says (in black and white) "we'll buy your company for a lot of money. And then after two years after we put some more money into it, then we'll give you more money"

    You my good sir, are naïve.

    or a world class scammer that had the gonads to stand before multimillionaires and pitch that.

  26. KAOS NATION says:

    What kind of strategy is that?! Not even operational fully in the UK but want to go international?! So the pitch to other countries then will be "yeah, we dont know how well it works yet cause basically no one uses it in the UK"…

    That's gonna look really promising and definitely not be drowned out in the market among all the other gazillion apps… /s.

  27. jrb1802uk says:

    I miss Jenny. Don't like the new female Dragon

  28. Informed Choice says:

    They must have spent a lot on the bullshit department.

  29. Ram Adavan says:

    Why did Jenny leave? I miss her sooooooo 😁😜

  30. Jack Mythen says:

    Can the commentator actually just stop with the puns in every single episode

  31. MrDenial says:

    I don't think they actually look at the value of their companies. Looks like they just want money and have x percentage to give.

  32. R S says:

    "Expand internationally" 🤦🏽‍♂️

  33. sgradone says:

    Goes in wanting to be honest and tell the truth.
    Then lies about the value someone wanted to purchase his company for.

  34. Alpha Legion Astartes says:

    I think he completely screwed up the pitch. Forget the bloody coverage. You have an app. You download it then use your phone as you would normally for at least a month. Meanwhile, the app tracks your usage statistics – texts, call minutes, data MB used. It then searches the internet for the cheapest contract that would cover you needs. It allows you to save money. Which is why people will download it. He failed to explain that.

  35. jack black says:

    fraudsters look just like this guy. they look like anybody.

  36. Abhothra says:

    The narrator's pun game was on point in this one! 🤣 10/10

  37. MaRoMoRoStaR says:

    This guy has a real punchable face 👊

  38. David G says:

    The puns in this segment Lmao

  39. Lady A says:

    Peter Jones💕👍👍👍

  40. aussie114 says:

    Yboo has since gone into administration.

  41. Jon Cocks says:

    Jenny is finally out

  42. John Major says:

    Reminds me of Tim Cook

  43. Chris Thomson says:

    this guy is delusional

  44. HerrNilssonTheMonkey says:

    Chubby bird would be fit if she put down the fork.

  45. Hologramix 1 says:

    Why is Deborah wearing Jennys dress??

  46. Call me Tiger says:

    Why does Sarah Davies always look like she smells shit on her top lip?

  47. Fabolous NineNine says:

    The narrator has bars for days haha

  48. JCEmotep says:

    Honestly I don't really get Peter Jones. What does the total amount of users matter in regards to forming a map of the signal strength? Yes you need a certain amount of users near each mast, probably at varying distances and at varying times, but that's more a matter of the landmass of the UK and the total number of masts. That's like saying you need way more people to make a representative survey in China cause there is a lot of people there. It's just not how it statistics works, once you reach a certain sample size you can assume some statistical validity.

  49. ALEX MG says:

    Apart from Peter Jones and Deborah the rest of team dragons always change

  50. ALEX MG says:

    So that’s it for Martin, he is out

  51. radiowallofsound says:

    3:05 that's utter bullshit, with a population of 60 Million and a sample size of only 17k users, statistically you get a confidence level of 99% with a 1% margin error. and this guy had more than twice the sampling size.

  52. Partyfreaker says:

    Your mobile can scan all the provider signals in the envoirment. If you just map all the names to the companies and live scan which provider has the best coverage for you you can even set the scan to a few hours, few days or a week to check the best provider for your phone. Because every phone is different, every location is different and every housing is different.

  53. Jeffery Widegirth says:

    Entrepreneur- Hello drago…..
    Jenny – I’m out

  54. Stephen Kissane says:

    Did this guy work at enron?

  55. MarkDavidson / M__ZIME - GB&NI says:

    Have his glasses got lowerable lenses?
    Or am I going barmy?!!!

  56. Cool says:

    11:17 – she nods, he nods,
    I'm out

  57. HerrBratwurst says:

    A lot of projects that comes into these shows are just there to solve like 1 minor problem.

    for this service, it's just there to like help you maybe save 3-5quid a month.

  58. Dr Tune says:

    I enjoy the mild heckling from the comments section of Dragon's Den videos. It's like hanging out down the pub

  59. Dr Tune says:

    Also the "how many users do you have", the guy answered "we have 40k downloads" which if course is nothing like the same thing as monthly active users. After $1.5m spent that's a smoldering crater.

  60. Cosmin Banu says:

    I think it's retarded for Peter to compare the number of people with a cellular connection with the number of people that crowdsource the info. I mean, that kind of logic doesn't add up. The guy has enough info to make an educated aproximation. It's like saying why develop an Iphone app when more people have android? Usually Peter is a straight to the point kind of guy but here he really missed the mark…

  61. Katie Merrick says:

    The comments are the best

  62. Katie Merrick says:

    2 million is still a big offer!!

  63. Drew Maria says:

    Dude looks like an English Tim Cook. Maybe that'll go in his favor lol

  64. Jrezky says:

    2.5% LUL

  65. Ross says:

    Peter, its time to lay off the crack.

  66. Shutupand Sitdown says:

    I'm missing Jenny so much.
    And for that reason alone…

    …. I'm out!

  67. Steve Wilson says:

    https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/west-yorkshire-news/huddersfield-firm-yboo-whose-boss-17118463

  68. Matthew Olsen says:

    Dragons or sharks, anyone with a 10million valuation is only there for the advertising.

  69. El Bruce says:

    "We crowdsource the coverage data from our users, who are all people shopping for a carrier." I think I see the problem here…

  70. Alan Cogan says:

    Martin is from Holmfirth? Isn't that where they used to film 'Last of The Summer Wine'? I think that says it all really…😆😆😆

  71. I am Nizorro says:

    Combine the Static Network Maps and the User Based Data. Like, why drop out of so much data.

  72. Detective Maxis says:

    His beady little eyes make me feel uncomfortable

  73. Jacke Christensen says:

    He goes in pretending to care about transparancy then lies to the dragons

  74. EthanandBros says:

    why would the Dragons need him to buy them a drink when they have tens of millions??

  75. William Haddock says:

    Not so transparent methinks

  76. Spiritual Freedom says:

    I love all the dragons but Peter is my favourite by a long shot

  77. Ra Clarke says:

    Sara is trying to look older than she is with that hair style? She looks like she is in her mid thirties but trying to look in her 50s lol

  78. david harrison says:

    jenny: "hey martin, i'm not even in this episode because i'm out and for that reason i'm out."

  79. Françoise Dupré says:

    What's with the music?

  80. The Institution says:

    Delusional Tech Ltd. must be the name of the company! ✴

  81. dpb4free says:

    https://www.businesscloud.co.uk/news/investor-row-blamed-for-collapse-of-dragons-den-firm

  82. Cameron B says:

    Sara isn’t Jenny
    and for that reason I’m out

  83. Comanche Scalper says:

    We actually need this in Australia…. Some times the dragons just miss stuff, They assume they know it all. Still the guy came at it with the wrong approach.

  84. mateyko555 says:

    well, they didnt hear about opencellid.org free one or Ookla gathering those already?

  85. The Grim Reaper says:

    That guy is clearly a pervert who gets his kicks from being humiliated.

  86. Swift Nevison Bush Wrangler says:

    People being ripped off by phone companies. I’m here to sort this. Business model failure. I’m out

  87. Toys hanger says:

    Never been bothered with such stupid crap. I just shop around.

  88. Edu says:

    Jenny wishes she could be out on this

  89. Matt Greek ESASC says:

    Jenny is so out, she’s left the actual room.

  90. tewrgh says:

    because network operator coverage maps are so honest and accurate..

  91. Gilly says:

    Sara is kinda hot.

  92. daniish_1 says:

    It has gone into administration

  93. Grant Li says:

    i thought this man was tim cook when he walked on lol

  94. Joonas Laine says:

    Just gotta look at the nose and u know he is trying to take over the world. Also thanks in advance for the bans jewtube

  95. hospitalcleaner says:

    "I think you're dELuSioNaL "

  96. Moreno A. Hassem says:

    Peter Jones is completely off the mark here and knows shit about statistics. Of course geography and economics play a role, but 14k people is more than enough to represent 60 million users. Actually, it's an order of magnitude more.

    Also, his answer can be easily countered with initiatives like OpenSignal, which his company can obviously source from.

    My biggest problem with this business proposal is that you need a mobile phone with a connection to tell you what is the best connection. What the hell are they thinking?

    Overall, this program is about people grabbing to one reason not to invest and justifying their lack of interest on anything that is not easy money. Polar opposite of Shark Tank in which people seem to want to make it work, despite having to iron out problems. How can you thrive on an environment like this?

  97. arthur fleck says:

    Absolutely not gonna mention Jenny why would i mention Jenny. I mean Jenny is actually out this time for real. Jenny's not even in the building. Thats why i refuse to bring up Jenny's name. And i mean it.

  98. Dj Cheezy says:

    This guy looks like a budget Tim Cook bruh

  99. George Samaras says:

    hint* inferential statistics

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